UFO Disclosure/Contact, Part 11 - B. David Ruffino

Continuing information from a recent seminar, "Official Disclosure: Prepare For Contact," featuring top researchers, ex-government agents, world-famous field investigators, physicists and theologians. The post contains info directly from the featured speaker. Questioner is Thomas Horn. Any comments by me will be in brackets []. Very light editing done on Q&As.

B. David Ruffino is a well-known UFO researcher with over 45 years of background in the subject. He is an alien abduction counsellor, an ordained minister, and he has spoken in Roswell, on radio shows, and is the author of "Unholy Communion." How important is this book? Dr. Michael Heiser, in his endorsement, says: "If even 10% of the witnesses in this book are honest about what happened to them - and, in particular, how they were rescued from their torment, then David and Joseph [co-author] have earned the right to be heard."

Q: Are we alone? I want to ask you what you think of the tremendous and unprecedented amount of UFO and ET news coming out all at once, including at the Royal Society meetings in London, where the Royal Astronomer to the Queen of England actually said that aliens are staring us in the face, and we may not even know it?
A: If you look at it from my standpoint, a theological one, you can say the same thing the Royal Astronomer said. I believe these things are inter-dimensional ... spiritual ... sure, they're looking at us all the time. They're in another dimension, but they're looking at us. The Bible tells us that we're surrounded by a great host of witnesses, referring to the spiritual realm. So, certainly I agree with what he says, but we have different ideas on who they are and what their purposes are. Sometimes people who make these statements try to say that we are the aliens, that we were brought to earth a long time ago as seeds planted by the aliens, etc.

Q: The one thing that is nice is to finally see the top tier, the scientific community if you will, starting to take this phenomenon as real and saying that it deserves the kind of credible research that people like you have been doing in the past. Maybe now they are beginning to catch up. But I want to know what you think. So tell us what it is that you do in this field of study.
A: My wife and I run a ministry on the internet where we expose different things in society that we believe to be part of the strong delusion the Bible talks about that will be coming upon the earth in the last days. Jesus says the last days will be like the days of Noah just before the flood. One of the parallels we see is the alien abduction phenomenon, as it correlates with before the flood when the fallen angels legally married human women, and produced the Nephilim, the giants mentioned in the Bible. We want to show that what is happening today did happen before, and as Ecclesiastes says, there's nothing new under the sun. We want to help people to be prepared.

We also have a ministry called Paranormal and Alien Abduction Problem Solvers, Int'l (PAAPSI), where we counsel and guide people who have had alien abduction experiences, and they want it to be gone. Believe it or not, some people enjoy being abducted by aliens. But we counsel the people who have been harmed by it psychically, physically, spiritually and in many other ways. They want it to end, and we believe, as proven by the evidence, that we know the way out.

Q. Some people want to be abducted?
A: Two reasons. 1. Everyone wants to be wanted and needed, and these entities fulfill that need by saying they're special and they have a special mission for them. 2. Sort of a codependency.

Q: First time I've ever heard anyone say that. But, now that I think about it, I've met many abused people who fall into those categories. ... Some scientists think these things may not be so benign. What was the impetus on writing the book? Unholy Communion.
A: Heaven's Gate really opened a lot of eyes. Showed us that this thing was not innocuous, but deadly serious. If we can prevent even one leader or person from starting with this stuff it will be worth it. And that's why we started our ministries. A lot of people [ministers; seminars, etc.] said they were fallen angels, or whatever, but then they left and never followed up and ministered to these people. That's why the Mormons and Jehovah's Witness started...just enough information to make them dangerous. So we wanted to actually minister to them. And it's a specific ministry, very rewarding just to always be there to help them. [He said a lot more about the ministry, and it was immediately evident that he truly has the heart of a pastor and loves his work.]

Q: What was the youngest abductee?
A: Late teens, early twenties.

Q: You're also a minister, so is this like a congregation without walls? Ministering to individuals, even if they have a local church they can't really go to their church and talk about it much.
A: Yes, we minister to them at all hours and spend as much time as they need, even if it's 2-3 hours late at night. It's a great joy, a special calling of sorts. A lot of them aren't particularly of a church background, anyway. And a lot of the churches look at it as spooky.

Q: How do traditional pastors accept what you do?
A: I spent 25 yrs looking for a ministry in a church. Wagging heads, snickers, giggles was all I got. They weren't interested in that type of ministry. These people will not be prepared for what's coming. Our prayer is that these people don't fall away [mine, too], because it will be a great deception when it comes. Little by little, people are beginning to wake up, it seems.

Q: I do know about mission fields, numbers, etc. Statistically, we know that hundreds of thousands per year are experiencing this?
A: Great numbers. Teams are beginning to form that can address that particular mission field. It's a growing field - for abductees and for people prepared to help them. The growth on both sides is running neck and neck. There is even beginning to be support among some pastors.

Q: What do Christians in general think about it?
A: Just like the pastors. Some are starting to wake up, but the other half think we're wack jobs. People put their heads in the sand when it's something they don't understand. This is going to get a lot worse...so as it becomes more visible, more people will be open to dealing with it.

Q: How do you deal with people like that?
A: I'm not very subtle. I just tell them it's true and they need to be aware of it or they're in danger. The big churches have their own agendas, too. It's the smaller churches that seem to be more open. It was the same way for Jesus. You can't really tippy toe; you have to meet it head on.

Q: UFO community is a religion (New Age).
A: Most of them are in a hierarchical organization, if in one at all. The UFO community is the same way. Aliens, evangelists, channelers with messages, prophets. Same deal. It's a parallel religion. Heb 1:11. And the common man believes everything they say. [There are few who know what is going on. We have a huge responsibility to be watchmen and alert people, and few really want truth.]

Q: In 2008 you and Joe Jordan did a Roswell presentation that caused a real stir [among the UFO attendees]. Why?
A: We challenged their philosophy by presenting the aliens as demonic, and putting them on trial - their beliefs. So they were hostile. They didn't like being challenged, and you can bring up any religion at all except Christianity and Jesus. And Judaism. The world doesn't want accountability; they want a god that answers to them, one that is flexible. You could sense the alarms going off in the audience. They don't want truth. Itching ears.

Q: In the book you talk about something astonishing, that Jesus had encounters with aliens.
A: We make the assertion that these entities are the same ones that have always been around - he dealt with casting out demons, demoniacs...the same ones. They're all one and the same. If you look at the effect he had on the demons - and the effect his name has now - it's the exact same thing [he is so correct about this; it's an extremely important principle]. His name and power have the same effect now. With some people you have to be very subtle in making the connection between aliens and demons; they're not prepared to hear about Jesus. Only through the Holy Spirit can you navigate this area. I can often tell them exactly what the demons are saying [he's referring to the counterfeit theology they teach] ... and they see that if Jesus reveals this information....HE must be the true one.

Q: How you employ this careful analysis, confronting preconceived ideas, and ultimately no book has never been approached this way...almost a scientific investigation. You prove cause and effect...evidence..connect the dots. But most astonishing is how the name of Jesus emerges at the end of the book as the one thing that works with the entities. Great for the faith community. Only one name makes everyone bow. This may clear things up with Christians. Is this phenomenon psychic, physical or spiritual?
A: All of the above. Joe has actually been there when they've been catatonic; and when they come back [to full consciousness] they have a message. And sometimes the abductee says the entities are ticked off with Joe because the entities know who he is [I had to chuckle at this - "I know Jesus, and I know about Paul".... and these demonic entities know the people who discern who they are.] Now it's done [breeding, etc.] in labs and stuff instead of through marriage, but the Lord predicted this.

Q: Days of Noah...G.H. Pember's book ... analyzes Jesus prophecy, and he outlined how 'the 7th and most fearful sign' as being the appearance on earth of the Nephilim. Written in 1800s. [I have this book, "Earth's Earliest Ages," and it's an amazing book.] And now we have the Vatican etal.
A: This is a sign of the days of Noah - the Vatican - I have quite an alarm raised there because they influence over 1 billion people and are going to be told this is okay, they'll fall for it and be deceived. [I agree with him. The Vatican has many Satan worshippers and Masons at the highest levels, and I believe they are in league with the demonic forces.]
Webs: http://www.delusionresistance.org/, http://www.paapsi.org/

Royal Heir

UFO Disclosure/Contact, Part 9 - Stan Friedman

Continuing information from a recent seminar, "Official Disclosure: Prepare For Contact," featuring top researchers, ex-government agents, world-famous field investigators, physicists and theologians. The post contains info directly from the featured speaker. Any comments by me will be in brackets [].

Stan Friedman is a nuclear physicist and the original investigator of the 1947 Roswell event, internationally renowned for explaining just how the physics of intra-galactic travel might not be so impossible after all. Rec'd his degrees in physics from University of Chicago in 1955, employed for 15 yrs as a nuclear physicist for GE, then GM, Westinghouse, TRW Systems, Aerojet, General Nucleonics, MacDonald Douglas where he worked on such advanced classified projects as nuclear aircraft, nuclear fission and fusion rockets, nuclear power plants for space and more.

Friedman spent the entire first half of the interview bashing the Astronomer Royal of Great Britain, the Royal Society itself, and any person who maintained that aliens were inter-dimensional entities and were not real visitors from other planets. This is to be expected; see my comment at the end. I did not include those comments in this blog. He was immediately unlikeable, arrogant, dogmatic, and reminded me of some of the science PhD's I encountered as an employee at a university, who denigrated anyone with an opinion different than the one they held. Friedman says: My view of the situation is drastically different because I do not assume that absence of evidence is evidence for absence.

Q: Is there anything positive in the fact that the scientific community has at least started talking about what you've been talking about for two decades?
A: I was glad to see that most of the coverage was pretty straight and I was glad to see Ted Peters' paper on the knowledge that alien contact would bring to religion. [He would be happy to see proof of visitors from other planets completely debunk all religion.] He's a theologian with a long term interest in UFOs. He's in Berkeley, and he did a survey of a lot of people and concluded that there really wouldn't be much upset to most religious people to find out we'd gotten a signal from aliens. The way the questions are asked is all important.

Q: But what if an Independence Day type craft suddenly was hovering over the White House?
A: Or if someone said three kids were abducted from the school yard; that would lead to an altogether different response.

Q: I think in any case it would be shocking. I don't care what your world view is, if all of a sudden tomorrow the sky was filled with some kind of technology that was apparent to everybody - for a little while it's at least going to close down the global economy and everyone is going to be standing there looking up wondering what will happen next. Some of the early studies from the government covered that, didn't they - when inferior cultures were confronted with superior cultures?
A: And a Brookings Institute report - about 40 yrs ago - which indicated that the group that would be most affected would be the scientific community, because they would suddenly realize they weren't all knowing. [He is taking another jab at the scientists who do not believe in beings from other planets.]

Q: I want to talk to you about the history behind Roswell. We interviewed Chuck Missler and he referred to your book on the MJ12 several times, and he talked about how what you had done illustrated the legitimacy of how some of those documents most likely are legitimate, and the phony ones are put in there for the purpose of disinformation, a known government tactic. To keep in order, let's go back to Roswell. Tell us the story about Roswell. How did you get involved in it? Roswell is probably the biggest UFO disinformation of all time. [This interviewer, Thomas Horn, is truly a master at detecting Friedman's personality. He disarms him by complimenting him - and then quotes another respected author who had also complimented Friedman, thus feeding the man's arrogance and ego. It was one of the most adroit uses of insight I've ever seen. ]

A: In the early 70s I heard about a lady in the Albuquerque area, who was working at a radio station and had a call from their Roswell affiliate, saying a saucer had crashed, and wanting to put the story out on the wire, ..so she's dictating this to put on the news wire, and suddenly a bell goes off on the machine "Do not continue this transmission. FBI." So I file it.

Then, in 1978 I was put in touch with Jesse Marcell, who had handled one of the Roswell saucers [he did not see or handle any saucer; he handled some strange pieces of material that his father brought home] when he was there in the military. He was one of the few people who could not deny that he was involved (Jesse, Sr.) because his name had been in the newspapers at the time. He was the Intelligence Officer at the Roswell Army Airfield. He was there on a Sunday when he got a call from the sheriff saying that a sheep rancher had come in with some strange materials, and said he had an entire field littered with the stuff. The base commander, Sherwin Cabot, asked Jesse to check it out. Blanchard was especially concerned about spying. He was the head of the 509th, the only atomic bombing group in the entire world.

Jesse Marcell, accompanied by another intel officer, go out and see the debris field, they find this huge area, 1/2-3/4 miles long, strewn with weird stuff. Jesse had served in the Pacific and had seen air crashes. There was nothing conventional there, he told me. No wires, no vacuum tubes, no tags saying "made in Oshkosh", no propellers, weird. He also figured out because there was no crater, and the stuff was strewn over a large area, that it had to be a midair explosion. So, they come back to town, Jesse wakes up his son, Jesse Jr., who was 11 at the time, and shows him some of this wreckage [I believe he was instructed by the military to mislead his family; of course, I have no proof of that, but he is the only military person I've ever heard of who showed or told his family about any such UFO details].

The next day he takes it in to the base for their morning meeting, and Col Blanchard gives two orders: 1. Get a B29 to take you and this stuff to our headquarters (8th AF) in Ft Worth. ..on your way to Wright Patterson AF Base, where captured enemy equipment was normally sent. He gives the 2nd order to the base Public Info Officer, to put out a press release saying we've now got one of these flying saucers people have been seeing. There had been a couple of thousand sightings in the previous TWO WEEKS. This was the week of July 4th, at the peak of interest, and all over the country papers had been jammed with articles.

When he reached Fort Worth, General Ramey (?), head of the 8th AF told Jesse not to say anything, that he would take care of it. He told the press there had been a mistake made, their was no UFO, just wreckage of a radar reflector/weather balloon combination, nothing to worry
about. The NY Times didn't have the story because the press release didn't go out until noon NM time, but by 4 PM Texas time, the cover story was all ready out. The LA paper had BOTH stories, "Army Captures Flying Saucer," "General Says It's Radar Gadget."

Q: Many of these people who were actually there and participated in the recovery had top secret security clearance, they were under rules to remain silent, but many of them as they neared death have come out and told a different story.
A: There is a DVD, "Recollections of Roswell," with testimony from 27 first hand witnesses, including Jesse Marcell, Jr. Most of the other people are dead.

Q: What has been the motive behind gov't agencies to want to cover up what has happened at Roswell and elsewhere?
A: I am not posing as a spokesman for the US government. [True...he isn't posing...]

Q: Some people say you are a government spokesman. You have referred to this as a "cosmic Watergate."

A: There is a piece on my website about gov't and UFOs. I normally give these reasons:
1. You want to figure out how they work...they make wonderful delivery and defense systems; that's where we spend a ton of money...everyone wants to have a weapons system. The first rule for security is you can't tell your friends without telling your enemies. [I'm surprised he said this, because our government spends billions in secret budgets for highly secret weapons and to 'make UFOs.']
2. The other side of the coin...what if the other guy figures out how they work before you do? How do you defend against them?
3. A political problem...If an announcement were to be made tomorrow by highly trusted people around the world, let's say the Queen and the Pope [....two good bets....] What if they were to say the world is being visited by intelligently controlled ET spacecraft, and let's say they portray them as being neutral, so it's not scary, as in 'we're going to be destroyed next month.' What would happen? The stock market would go down, hospital admissions would go up, there would be a strong response from a lot of people, chaos.
4. Some people would say they're more advanced than we are technologically, which means new methods of energy production; there go the oil companies, cars, air transport companies,
computers and communications systems ... economic chaos. [The government has technology we couldn't dream of...exchanged from the entities...we would have all the free energy the world could possibly use, such as scalar tech, if the truth were known. But then the oil companies would make no money...]
5. They may not be friendly. [When the government finally speaks to the public, they will portray the 'ET's' as a terrible threat to us. Tesla let this cat out of the bag many years ago.]

Q: Why do you think aliens would want to visit earth? What is so special about this planet?
A: I think aliens want to keep tabs on the primitives in the neighborhood who might pose a threat to them. So, I think the primary reason is to quarantine us. Secondly, ours is the densest planet in the solar system. A cubic foot of earth weighs more than a cubic foot of any other
planet, which means there are more heavy metals with very special properties here. We have rare earths here which we need for all the electronics; the aliens might have been stealing this stuff for years. There's gold, uranium, zirconium used heavily by the navies..under the ocean there are huge nodules...USOs,...who knows what they're doing down there? [Sounds like earth is a very, very special place.] I'm convinced there are all kinds of civilizations in our neighborhood; say, within 50 light years.

Q: What would you want your final commentary to be on this?
A: We're dealing with the biggest story of the millennium, the cover up of aliens from other planets. I think its time we realize we're not the big shots in the neighborhood. And maybe we ought to see ourselves as others see us, a warlike society that wastes its money killing. Children die needlessly of preventable starvation while our military budget for last year was over one
trillion dollars. There's more to life than our little quarrels down here. That may be the day we start to grow up.

MY COMMENTS. If I had not intensely studied this subject for the past 40 years I would not understand where this scientist is coming from. However, you are unlikely to hear the truth from any prominent scientist (remember Stephen Hawkings' recent statement? Same thing). There is a group called The Jason Society (or The Jason Group), to which all major scientists belong (if they value their lives). This group has been around for many years, and they are an arm of the governments and spout the views of the Illuminati. Those scientists who do not wish to cooperate by being members of this group will not be tolerated. That is why over 90 major scientists have died under 'suspicious circumstances' over the past several years.

Jason members foster the views the Government would like for us to believe, that these are alien beings from numerous planets and they wish to do us harm. A massive worldwide landing by these aliens would serve to unite the people of earth around a one-world government like nothing else. For this reason, these scientists are the ones who are so frequently on the History or Discovery Channel programs about UFOs.
This is why Friedman is so rabidly hostile to the view which is rapidly building, that these are inter-dimensional demonic entities. He is essentially a government agent.

Royal Heir

UFO Disclosure/Contact, Part 6 - Joe Jordan

Continuing information from a recent seminar, "Official Disclosure: Prepare For Contact," featuring top researchers, ex-government agents, world-famous field investigators, physicists and theologians. The post contains info directly from the featured speaker. Any comments by me will be in brackets []. Very light editing done on Q&As. (Whew!)

Joe Jordan is a 16-yr field investigator for the Mutual UFO Network, President of the CE4 Research Group, Co-founder of the Paranormal and Alien Abductors Problem Solvers Int'l (PAAPSI). Joe is also the co-author, with David Ruffino, of the upcoming book, "Unholy
Communion: The Alien Abduction Phenomenon, Where It Originates and How It Stops," about which Dr. Michael Heiser in his endorsement of the book, said: "If even 10% of the witnesses in this book are honest about what happened to them, and in particular how they were rescued from their torment, then David and Joseph have earned the right to be heard."

Q: Can you explain to the listeners what CE4 stands for?
A: Close Encounter of the Fourth Kind, which is alien abductions.

Q: I want to ask you about this spate of recent news concerning the big question: are we alone in the universe, that is coming out of the Royal Society meetings. I have 10-12 headlines in front of me that have all come out in the last few days, one from yesterday, "Lord Rees Says Aliens May Be Staring Us in The Face." There has never been a time in history when you had such a panel of scientists as in the Royal Society meetings taking this issue head on and actually talking about it in terms of it being a real phenomenon, and therefore that there should be a concerted effort on the part of NASA, governments, to look deeply into this whole subject of astrobiology.
A: I've seen more and more of this starting to come out over the past couple years. When I got into UFO research 16 years ago it was nothing like it is today, and the push for disclosure and research being done in the scientific fields compared to 15-20 years ago has dramatically changed.

Q: How did you enter the field of UFO research?
A: It's not something I was always interested in. It was kind of accidental. I was on a vacation, and I had a 10-hour flight ahead of me to go to Alaska. I stopped in a little news stand in the airport and picked up a book, and being an avid sci-fi reader, I thought I had a sci-fi book in my hand, and when I flipped the book over and read the back cover I was puzzled, because it said this book was about honest, serious investigation, It puzzled me that what looked like sci-fi could in any way be related to serious investigations, and the title of it was "UFO Crash in Roswell." The book consumed me, and I couldn't put my head around it. I had no background in the study of UFOs and no interest at all in the subject. Over the next couple of months I contacted some of the people that were part of MUFON and became a member, then trained to be a field investigator and after a while I had my own team of investigators. I continue to stay with MUFON for a number of reasons. They helped me right at the beginning in the training and provided a basis and foundation from which to work, and I recommend people who want to get into the research aspect of UFOs to become a MUFON member. I think it's an excellent group.

Q: How open is MUFON if an investigation seems to be going in the direction of the metaphysical or paranormal, or smacks of the demonic. Do you find a resistance to that kind of thinking, are they open to it, or what?
A: There's quite a resistance to it. That's something I've encountered over the years, but it doesn't deter me from working with them. I guess it's kind of a love/hate relationship. They know what I've come across and what my research consists of, and they are not open to it and they really won't talk to me about it.

Q: When you say there's a resistance to it, are you talking about it from an organizational point of view? Have you come into contact with other members who believe there could be something in this that is other-worldly?
A: Oh, yes. And I've seen that change happen over the years. When I first got into this, the push was to verify the so-called aliens are ET biological entities, and I've seen the move away from that over the years, to more and more it being termed 'inter-dimensional,' and I guess they're at a loss to explain the abilities that these entities have. The shift going into the inter-dimensional aspect of it kind of gives them an answer to work with for what these entities are able to do.

Q: For you, specifically, when did your research start focusing on alien abductions?
A: As a state section director for MUFON, we had monthly meetings, and after the first couple of years we started to see that doing sighting investigations was like chasing your tail. MUFON has been doing sighting investigations since 1959, and it still continues today. But we saw that we weren't going to get to any of the answers we wanted out of this research unless we changed our avenue of focus. And because of our monthly meetings, we started hearing stories from people attending the meetings, claiming that they were either contactees or abductees. So we started listening to their stories and thinking about their involvement with this phenomenon. We started to realize that if you're trying to get to the source of what this is all about you need to get closer to the source itself. We realized that these people who were claiming contact or the abduction
experience were closer to the source of the experience than the people who were having sighting only. So we decided to move our focus to the abduction realm because they seemed to be on the front line of the UFO phenomenon.

Q: Were you seeing anything different in your research than that of other abduction researchers?
A: Once we started really getting in depth and doing the investigations with the experiencers themselves we were not seeing anything different in our findings than what most of the top researchers in the world were already seeing. We couldn't understand what was causing the experience, why certain people had the experience, and why was it seeming to be generational? We didn't have any more answers than they did. [Generational is key. It is very common for demonic activity to inhabit generation after generation of individuals.]

Q: You soon came across something very different in your findings that would change the course of your abduction research. Can you enlighten us a little bit on that?
A: Yes, and this was where the line of my focus on UFO research has been for the last 16 years. We came across one very unusual case that we had to look at very closely and try to understand what was happening. A gentleman was sharing his story, and during our interviewing of him and he stated that he had a typical abduction experience in 1976, but during the actual experience he had fallen into a panic situation. He was in sheer terror of the experience itself. During the experience he called out in the name of Jesus Christ, and he said the experience abruptly stopped. Well, that puzzled us because in all the research we had done, and in all of our reading
and watching videos, etc., we never saw where anybody had ever stopped an experience. As a matter of fact, most of the researchers were saying it wasn't possible. But here we had a particular case of a man saying he had stopped this experience ABRUPTLY while it was happening. And this was the method that he used. So we started to look into that and I contacted some of the top abduction researchers in the country and shared this with them, and each time we shared this with one, he would say "Can I go off the record?" And I said, "Sure, just help me here." Off the record, meaning I can't tell you who said what, but I can tell you what they said. My question to them was, "Have you ever come across this type of experience in your research?" And what I was getting from them was, "Yes, we have." So I asked them why they had not shared this information, because we haven't read about it anywhere in your writings, we haven't heard about it or seen it in any of your conference materials, and most UFO researchers say it's not possible. The answer I got from most of them was that they didn't know what to make of it. I would have been fine with that, but most of them had another answer that came along with that, and it was "We didn't want to go there, because it might hinder the way we're looked at in the field of research." And, I thought, these guys are sitting on relevant information and not sharing it. That's called COVER UP. Here they have findings in their research, but because they're uncomfortable sharing it because of their reputations, they just don't report it. When I realized what was happening I told them that I had nothing to lose - I've come across something very unusual, I've confirmed that there are other cases like this. I'm going to take this one piece of the puzzle and run with it, and I'm going to find more of these cases and document them because it needs to be shared. It's part of the entire picture, one of the puzzle pieces that shows us what we're dealing with. That's when my research started to change, and that was
about 13 years ago.

Q: There have been various secular researchers, for instance Jacques Vallee, Dr. John Mack, Dr. John Keel, even Hynek; and they found that there was a strong similarity, if not an exact parallel, in their study of alien abduction phenomenon and historic demonology - demonism. They write about it in their own works. I'm talking about SECULAR researchers that said they had come to conclude that whatever this phenomenon is, in their minds it was identical to the biblical stories of demonism, and some of the stories of folk lore where people were visited by incubus and succubus, etc.

Q:How did you then go about building a database of these similar testimonies concerning deliverance by the name of Jesus, which would certainly carry with it the idea that this was most likely something of a demonic nature. And it also illustrates that in any case, no matter what it was, even if it was something from another world, that it would be subject to the authority of the name of Jesus Christ. Now, how in the world do you go about building a database of testimonies where you're finding redundancy to that story line?
A: That was our biggest problem in the beginning. Because we were confirmed by these other researchers that these types of cases were out there, and the hard part was trying to locate them. You want to be careful when doing the research that you aren't 'leading' these cases. I didn't want to put myself in a situation where I was out there trying to hunt these people down.
I wanted to make sure that they knew I was available, and they could freely come to me. And that's very important when you're building the researcher database, and I still stick by that today. I never search for them. We didn't know what to do in the beginning to get this started. And we were lucky enough, my partner and I who started CE4, we had a local newspaper reporter that had worked with us over the years in our local monthly MUFON meetings. He was always trying to keep an article going about us with upcoming events, etc., and when we came across this particular part of the research we brought it to him. He said the spiritual aspect was not his field of reporting and suggested we talk to the religious editor. He introduced us to her, Rita Elkins, at the Florida Today newspaper, and she took the information and put it together. We ended up getting two pages in the "People" section. And we were happy about that. During the next couple of weeks we got calls from all over the country. Gannett owned the paper, and they ran it in their affiliates all over the country. This was our first big exposure that let people know we were interested in this type of information. This was in 1997. The internet was just taking off back then, and someone picked it up on the internet, and it took off worldwide. Then a couple of months later, Flying Saucer Review printed the entire article. It was amazing because we had no idea how to get this information out there. We knew that people who didn't like it couldn't do anything to stop it at this point. Then we built our own website and started putting some of these stories up. ww.CE4Research.com. I think we have about 90 of the 400 or so cases on the site.

Q: Were you a Christian when you started this research?
A: No, I wasn't. I was pretty much an agnostic. I didn't believe in God. In fact I saw that as advantage, and it would be a good open, honest and totally objective and unbiased way to come into the area of UFO research. As I worked in the field I saw an increasing amount of New Age and metaphysical thinking involved in the UFO phenomenon, and I got tied up into that for about four years. It was in November 1996 that I had the gospel of Jesus Christ introduced to me in a way that I'd never heard it before, and became a Christian right at the time that I saw that first case about the intervention of Jesus. So I've seen this phenomenon from three different perspectives - agnostic, New Age, and Christian.

Q: What were your first feelings about this guy who said he'd stopped his abduction experience through the name of Jesus Christ? Were you a Christian by that time?
A; I had just become a Christian - brand spankin' new.

Q: Sounds like maybe God got you ready just in time, for what he wanted you to do. Have you shared your feelings and your findings with the UFO community in general?
A: I have been working on that over the years and having a hard time doing it. I spoke at Roswell at the UFO Festival a number of times, trying to share the message because a lot of people come there looking for answers, and it's kind of the Mecca for the UFOers. I had the opportunity to work with Guy Malone, who was the Director of the 60th Festival for the City of
Roswell. He got me a speaking position in 2007, and that was the first time I really had a public opportunity to share it with the secular community. And it was a hostile crowd. But I was able to get the message across. The Q&A got a little hostile. Then in 2008 I had the opportunity to be the Director of the Roswell UFO Conference for the city's UFO Festival, and again I had the
opportunity to share the gospel, and Dave Ruffino and I gave the "Unholy Communion" talk, and it pretty much shocked them. By that time we had their full attention. They never saw what was coming at them. You can hear that talk on my website in its entirety, and you can see why they were kind of angry. The researchers there were kind of hostile after we shared that talk, but at least we had a chance to share that piece of the puzzle at the table after all these years. It's been a tough one, trying to share it.

Q: Have you been able to help other people with the findings on your research?
A: Yes, and that wasn't our main intent in the beginning. When we started doing this research, all I wanted to do was to compile the data and let people take it for what they wanted to take it as. But the more we worked with these experiencers and had hundreds of opportunities to speak with these people, we started seeing some similarities that we needed to consider and making sure that we were keeping track of. Once we started getting all these testimonies posted up on the website, not only was I getting people contacting me, saying, "I'd like to share my testimony
because I've done this, too," we were having those that were contacting us saying: "I've read these testimonies; I'm having these experiences; can you help me stop them?" We were seeing people able to stop it and never again have the experience in their lives, and we then could say that, yes, we thought we could help them, and we have been able to help these people
stop the experiences, also.

Q: So it turned into a whole community of people that you minister to on a whole different level than what most of us are used to.
A: Yes. And there are only a handful of us in the world that have taken on this group of people. I guess you could call this a mission field. And if you listen to the polls that have been done on this over the years, they estimate possibly millions of people have been through this experience, and
it's terrifying. It turns your life upside down. There are a lot of hurting people out there that have had this experience, and there's just not a foundation set up to help them in the right way

Q: I would imagine that these people probably question their own sanity at times.
A; Oh, absolutely. In one of the talks I'm getting ready to do in Nashville, The Last Days Conference, at the end of April, and I'm continuing with my 'unholy communion' talks and I'm going to go deeper and explain how this has destroyed people's lives.

Q: There have been some secular researchers that have come across experiencers that have said that they used the name of Jesus and it didn't work. What would you say in response to these claims?
A: I've had this one thrown at me a number of times; it's one they try to trip me up with. There are some good answers for this question. What we have found here is not a magic word; it's not something you would use like 'abracadabra.' This must come from a belief, straight from the heart. We're seeing that these entities recognize this name as the authority, but they also recognize whether the person actually accepts that as the authority in his life. This is extremely important and needs to be recognized. The only way this works is for people who have actually claimed Jesus Christ as their Lord and Master, and have a personal relationship that they have been working on with Jesus Christ. The Bible says that Jesus knows his sheep. This name, Jesus, is thrown around in this field in a number of ways. You hear, for instance, the New Agers using the term "Christ consciousness" and we hear people say they've met Jesus on the space ships. Well, excuse me, that's not the same one that's working here in this instance. These people that say they've tried this and it didn't work - if I had a little bit of time to work with them ... next time it would work. When secular researchers tell me this I ask if they can introduce me to the particular persons; I'd like to speak with them. That never happens. But at the same time, I've brought my cases forward, and these people are there to talk to anyone who wants to talk to them. They are not secret. Many are on the website. At my 2008 conference I had 10 people up on that stage who were living examples...you never see that at UFO conferences. You see fuzzy pictures, fuzzy videos, people saying 'trust me, this is what I found.' I specifically tell people at the end of these conferences, "Please, don't trust me. Trust the evidence." Secular researchers won't even talk to them. They won't check them out to see if they're real - because they know they are, and they don't want to deal with it. It's easier for them to just come against me personally, as a Christian.

Q: What do you believe is the agenda of these alien entities?
A: I believe that what's happening here is a powerful delusion and deception. What I'm seeing as a result of people coming into contact with them is that it takes their focus off the one true God, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. These entities come with a message. A lot of these
experiencers have come into contact with communications that are always anti-God, anti-Bible, anti-Christ. They're coming here to preach a new gospel, which we have been warned about in the Bible. This is why the title of my next seminar is "Casualties of a Cosmic War." The prize of this war is eternal souls, and I think these people are doomed if they don't get help.

Q: A lot of researchers and scientists are pressing for disclosure by the US Gov't. Are you in favor of that, and do you think it will happen?
A: I am in favor of disclosure, and in 2007 at the 60th Anniversary Conference, Stephen Bassing (sp?) was there and he was pushing for US disclosure, and I agree. I have my view of what this is all about, but I can no more get my message out there than he can. But the secular researchers
are pushing for government disclosure, and I'm all for it because I'm going to ride that wave. If they can get some kind of recognition and public awareness of this phenomenon, then they're also going to have to listen to our findings, which will give us an avenue to share with the public the unwanted piece of the puzzle.

Q: I want to also get your position on recent Vatican comments. You have astronomers, one of which said recently that there is a certain possibility, from their point of view, of intelligent life out there in the universe - and that idea would not contradict the Catholic faith. Those statements by Funes were the latest in a string of comments by Vatican astronomers who are evidently confirming a belief they have that discovery might be made in the near future, and they're talking about ET Intelligence, not micro-organisms; and that this discovery will not unhinge the doctrine of Christ. Balducci not only said that ET's are real, but they are on earth now, and even inter-acting with the earth governments, and that people at the highest levels of the Vatican administration were aware of it. Before that, maverick Catholic theologian, Malachi Martin, said the reason the Vatican is so invested in this is because they know what is coming. It seems like the Vatican either knows something that we don't know, or at a minimum they're trying to preserve their authority among the laity by positioning themselves, just in case. This is the same institution that put people to death who questioned whether the earth was flat or round.
A: Well, I'd almost have to go with the latter of what you suggested. I don't see in biblical scripture that there is even an allowing of the possibility of ET life. I believe you will find intelligent life out there, but it won't be ET or biological entities. I believe that the reference of the 'host of heaven' being the angelic realm - most people would say that's from a supernatural realm, or that they do exist. But if they are part of God's creation like we are, then it's not a supernatural realm; it's part of the natural realm. I think when you start looking at the fruits of what these entities do, and what they communicate, and their effects on people, you're going to see that they're not very good [righteous]. I think we're going to have a lot of work to do in picking up the pieces from people who get involved with them. I think the Vatican is very deceived on all of this. I don't understand exactly what their purpose is in making the statements they've made, except that they haven't done the research.

Q: Could it be part of a great deception?
A: Oh, absolutely. We're seeing that come at us from so many different avenues, whether it be from the Vatican or Hollywood or different governments that are pushing agendas, we're seeing a lot of deception going on in this field. We're seeing deception from the researchers
themselves, the ones we've been relying on for the truth. They're only sharing what fits their agenda.

Q: Some of the Christian theologians we've been talking to about eschatological issues have a theory that the Vatican could even unknowingly [or knowingly] play into a deception where they are saying if these things appear they are our space brothers, a part of the family of God. They say they won't disrupt the authority of the church or unhinge the doctrine of Christ, and that this sets people up to be willing to accept, as part of God's family, the appearance of these things, so that if there's a Rapture and people are missing, and all of a sudden there's an armada of spaceships and these 'brothers in Christ,' according to the Vatican, say 'we took some of them away and left some of you here' ... is this all just sci-fi, in terms of theology, eschatology? Do you think there's anything about any of this that could really play out that way?
A: I think it's a possibility. That's just a personal opinion. What I will tell you is that in the research I worked with, I tried not to push my personal opinion. I like for people to just look at the evidence. Which may bring up some of these questions in their own minds.

Q: Even among non-Christians, some espouse what they call the 'ancient astronaut theory.' Can you explain this theory and how your views would differ from theirs?
A: Their idea is that there were beings [aliens] here in our ancient history, and they were mistaken for gods. The one thing that people are not understanding is that these are gods with a small 'g'. And that's the deception. And what we're dealing with here is that these entities are the same small 'g' gods from ancient history [fallen angels and their offspring]. The ones that Hynek and Vallee wrote about, the little gods, are the ETs, and we've been dealing with them throughout history, all along. They're still doing the same deceptive things, except to a higher degree. This is something that needs to be looked at, and that is the extent of the deception that we're dealing with now, compared to earlier times. I think it's leading up to something very big, a culmination of events that are happening.

Q: You mentioned things that happened earlier in history; there are some people who believe that this ET contact, both ancient and modern, it is related to ancient fallen angels, who gave birth to the Nephilim, that what they were doing in their day is somehow related to what's happening now. And that this could even play some role in fulfilling this prophecy of Christ,
that 'as it was in the days of Noah,' so will it also be at his coming. Do you think there is anything to that?
A: I do. I don't know to what extent. I think some of the best work I've read on that is by Steven Quayle, where he shows how these particular entities in history, that we're talking about, seemed to have been power players in all the different religions around the world. If you look at it as a whole, there are really only two religions, the ones that are of Christ, and all of those that are not. He is able to show that these entities have been behind all of those other ones that are not of Christ.

Q: Now also among the schools of thought about these aliens, some people believe that it doesn't matter if they're angelic, demonic, ET, but they believe they are actually traveling to the earth from far distances away, by advanced technology, wormholes, etc. And then there's another school of thought that believes they exist all around us in parallel dimensions. They use a portal,
a stargate, a doorway, etc. and are literally moving from one of the possibly ten dimension, into our three (or four) dimensional reality, and for that moment in time they become visible and tangible to us, and then they can move back out.
A: I believe what you're describing there is what you would refer to as a manifestation. If the research that I have, showing that people were able to stop these entities in the name and authority of Jesus Christ, along with their documented abilities that these entities have, leads us to believe that we're dealing with an inter-dimensional entity. If you're looking at scripture those were called angelic hosts, and with the messages that are coming from them, they are demonic hosts; what we're seeing is their manifestation ability. Because in scripture you're able to see the abilities of God's angels. Science likes to say there are a number of dimensions, but as a Christian looking at scripture we know there are two: there is the spiritual dimension, then there's the physical dimension; and they live in the spiritual dimension, but they have the ability to manifest into the physical. Scripture shows us that. And these fallen angels I believe have the same abilities as God's good angels, just with a different purpose - an evil purpose. And this is something we do see in the abduction experience where these people have seen these entities actually appear, and then actually disappear. And we're seeing that ability; that's not an ET biological entity ability. This is something that's coming from another dimension and manifesting to this dimension. I believe that if this is what it's showing, that these are what is called angels in scripture, then, no, they're not from out there. They're from right here. And they're all around us all the time, and the deception that we're seeing here is their manifestation coming across in the facade of the ET, because that's something they want us to believe in.

Q: In this field of study there are basically two primary things that turn up. It's the aliens, the 'pilots' of the UFO crafts; and then there's the UFO craft itself. You have two separate things. Some people believe it isn't two separate things; it's just simply the way that these things are manifesting themselves. In other words, the craft is the spirit; the spirit is the craft. A couple of years ago during the 60th anniversary of the Roswell event, we interviewed Stanton Friedman, who is convinced that there was a tangible craft - an actual craft - that was recovered. Have you looked into that part of the Roswell event and do you believe that there was an actual craft that
would be extraordinary, in other words it wasn't a weather balloon; it was something unearthly? It wasn't built by the Russians or us; it was something tangible and yet not of this world? Do you have any thoughts on that?
A: I have looked into that, and continue to look into that, and that is such a research mess going on there. We're seeing so much misinformation going on, besides good information, so it's hard to sort it out. I know these guys are trying real hard to get answers.

Q:Could it be that these entities left something behind for this event?
A: It's a possibility. I do leave that open, that they could have left something, and one of the best descriptions of Roswell that I ever heard was back in 2003 at Roswell, and I was listening to Richard Hoagland - just a group of us standing around talking - and somebody asked him what he thought of the Roswell event? It's not his type of research, but he did make a unique statement that I'll never forget. He felt that what he knew about the research into the Roswell event was a Trojan Horse. I thought that was most profound. [So do I.] In other words, that whole event was a setup by these entities - to perpetuate this deception. And what we're seeing here is, I believe, whatever it takes to get you to believe that these entities are really aliens.

Q: What's so interesting is that when I asked you that question, what I had written down was 'Trojan Horse,' ... and if you didn't go there, I was going to ask you if you thought that could be a possibility. Great minds think alike! As far as I know this is the first time in such studies that this kind of analytical duplication - where you're using guidelines for redundancy - has been
employed in this way, because this (talking about Jordan's new book) is a methodology that's similar to what scientists or investigators would use to illustrate repeatability. And as I was reading your book, this is what kept standing out to me, because in science this is how you make your case, how you get something peer-reviewed, is that you repeat it over and over again, and therefore you can get what's called 'cause and effect.' You're using scientific methodology to try to prove something, a pattern to something that is otherwise extraordinary, and in this case it has to do with abduction and deliverance, in which the name of Jesus Christ emerges in a way that you said earlier, no other name ... it's not a magic formula. It really comes down to a matter of faith, and when you're a part of the body of Christ, you then do have an authority and evidently that authority extends to whatever theses things are, according to your research. [I agree.]
A: Some people could be dealing with medications, with sleep paralysis, you can't go into looking for demons behind every bush. Some could be dealing with mental issues, and all of those things must be considered before it gets down to what I believe is a spiritual event.
Q: Any final comments?
A: I would say that the one thing that I'm having the biggest trouble with in all the years is getting people to look at the evidence for itself. I want people to not trust me, but to look at the evidence and trust that. It's free to be looked at on www.CD4research.com

___________END

COMMENT: After studying the spirit world and UFOs for almost 40 years, I believe this guy has hit the nail right on the head. This, in my opinion, is exactly the true situation and explanation of UFOs - including the idea that the 'craft' at Roswell was a Trojan Horse scenario.

Royal Heir

UFO Disclosure/Contact, Part 4 - Jesse Marcel, Jr

Continuing information from a recent seminar, "Official Disclosure: Prepare For Contact," featuring top researchers, ex-government agents, world-famous field investigators, physicists and theologians. The post contains info directly from the featured speaker. Any comments by me will be in brackets [].

Col Jesse Marcel, Jr. says that a craft was recovered at Roswell. His father, Jesse Marcel, Sr. was the lead military investigator into the crash in 1947. Jesse, Jr. is the only man still alive who actually handled the debris from 1947. A rancher had discovered the debris and called the sheriff, who called Colonel Blanchard, the Base Commander, who sent his father to check it out.

After going to the site, Jesse's father brought some of the metallic debris home to show the family. It had writing on it which was similar to geometric symbols and looked like it was meant to be read or interpreted. Colonel Blanchard authorized a press release saying the AF had captured a flying disk, and it was published in a few papers. A few hours later the press release was retracted on orders above Blanchard, from Fort Worth.

Jesse, Jr. said the pictures which were taken of the debris, which he viewed later, were not of the same material his father had actually found; it was evidently disinformation. His father then sat him and his brothers down and said it could never be talked about again - ever - it never happened.

Jesse Marcel, Sr., his father, was an Intelligence Officer on faculty of Air Force Intel School at Pittsburgh, PA., and was highly qualified for just such an evaluation. Jesse, Jr. worked in Iraq as a doctor for the 189th Helicopter Division and was discharged in 2005.

"Roswell Legacy" is Jesse Marcel, Jr.'s new book's title. He wrote the book because he wanted to establish his dad's credibility. After his father died the government started attacking his father's story through disinformation, and Jesse, Jr. wanted to vindicate him.

Q& A Session (partial):

Q: Did you ever see the same material again?
A: No. Although I have looked at various types of foil similar to the Mylar which was said to be from the crafts, they were close to what I saw, but not exactly the same. The Government's story kept changing over the years (as people died, etc.). They went from weather balloon story to a top secret balloon type. The problem with that is, while the balloon was different, the material was the same as a regular weather balloon, unlike the craft debris.

Q: Were the 'aliens' 6' tall dummies, as some say?
A: No...they were small, according to a friend of mine who saw them. The girlfriend (nurse) of the guy who saw them said they were short, large eyes, very small noses - typical to greys...in fact, he heard them order some small caskets for them. [Rumors: a friend of a friend...]

Q: There is more recent credible testimony from widow of General Cordis; she has been speaking out after her husband died. After many years of refusing to tell her about Roswell, when he was approaching death he finally told her the reason he had refused to tell her about it was that he didn't want to challenge her worldview, as it had changed his. It is interesting that all these people had solid reputations until they began to talk. They had nothing to gain by lying about it. Most realized that disinformation agents would damage their reputations, but as they got older they decided to talk, and many have come forward. Who was the farmer that found the debris?
A: He and his son had a ranch out there, and that's where it landed. Bill Brazile (sp?) put some of it in his saddlebag, got drunk and started showing it around. Before long some well-dressed men came and took it from him. Next thing you know he was driving a new pickup and started a business with money everyone knew he didn't have.

Q: Have you ever seen the movie, Roswell? Did they portray you accurately?
A: Generally...not all the details.

Q: Your trip to Washington?
A: I went to a UFO meeting in D.C., and before going, I got a call from some government or military person in the Capitol who wanted to talk to me when I got there (I hadn't told anyone I was going). I got to the hotel and there was a phone message waiting. So I called the man and went to meet him at the Capitol building. He took me down into the bowels of the Capitol, and said he wanted to talk in a secure area. If was all a little furtive. We went down into a beautiful room, and on the table was a book on Roswell; the man pointed to it and said, "This isn't fiction." So I asked the guy 'when are you going to tell the public what happened there?' He answered, "If it was up to me I'd have told them yesterday, but it's not up to me. Another group has charge of this. He said that the group was spending money illegally, that Congress knew nothing about, and that it was his job to investigate this 'black group' spending this money to keep it secret. This was the first time I had had actually heard someone in the government say Roswell was the real thing. The guy also asked me if I'd gotten any threatening phone calls, which I had not. He told me to 'call me and I'll investigate it if you do.' I never got any.

Q: Interesting how you've got these secret government departments working against each other, black ops, black officers. I think I know who you're talking about, but I won't say his name. He was an aide to a senator. It's amazing you got involved in that, and had someone tell you all this. One side wants disclosure and the other wants to put a lid on it.
A: Yeah, here you have a black ops group, with unlimited funding, that Congress knows nothing about, controlled by a black military that is unknown to the government because of its higher classification.

Q: Did the debris frighten your family when your dad brought it in?
A: No ... it was just interesting. He was so excited about dealing with a flying saucer. I was in the right place at the right time to see something hardly anyone has ever seen.

Q: Do you think there will be an official disclosure, and do you favor it?
A: I'd love to see it released...to say I told you so...to confirm my experience.

_________END

The main reason I posted this, the most 'far out' of the interviews, is because I believe Jesse Marcel, Jr. is entirely sincere and honest in telling his story, which everyone has probably viewed on cable tv. However, I believe he has been misled every step of the way. The story serves to show the incredible range of information (or disinformation) that came out of Roswell.

Many people have tried to research, sort through and come up with the truth of what happened at Roswell. No one has been completely successful, and the well-hidden events remain murky to the public.

I believe the story regarding the craft itself was a Trojan Horse cover story created by the U.S. Military. Something of great significance, however, did happen there. This was when the Military began to seriously engage the entities and began working with them (calling them 'aliens'). Since 1947 it is well established that superior technology from these entities was given to the U.S. Military in exchange for certain privileges and access to human beings. A treaty was made. There is ample evidence of this.

Royal Heir

UFO Disclosure/Contact, Part 3 - Nick Pope

Continuing information from a recent seminar, "Official Disclosure: Prepare For Contact," featuring top researchers, ex-government agents, world-famous field investigators, physicists and theologians. The post contains info directly from the featured speaker. Any comments by me will be in brackets [].

Nick Pope is the former Project Director for the British Classified UFO Project, in the Ministry of Defense. He was initially skeptical until hearing testimony in the 2-day discussion held by the Royal Society, the 350-year old organization considered the most prodigious science organization in the world. It is inconceivable that even 2-3 years ago this organization would have sponsored such a discussion.

Nick Pope said that there is a compelling body of evidence of consistent and unexplained UFO subject matter, such as the Rendlesham Forest incident in 1980, in which he was involved in a cold case review in 1994, for the British Ministry of Defense.

The famed Rendlesham Forest incident, which has been shown many times on cable TV, was a series of encounters at two USA air force bases in England, and occurred over a period of three nights. The first night involved strange lights, in which Air Force personnel went out to investigate what they thought was a crash of some sort. They found a landed metallic craft, touched it, noted strange symbols on it which were similar to Egyptian hieroglyphics. The Defense Intelligence staff assessed radiation readings at the site which were significantly high. When they went back to the clearing they found three indentations in the shape of a triangle. Radiation levels peaked in the three holes.

On the second night, at a Christmas base party, the door burst open, and man rushed in, saying, "It's back!" They went out again, thinking to debunk it, but Pope saw it himself, along with high ranking senior military officer, Charles Holt.

Asked whether any of the people there ever experience any mental or physical issues after the incident, Pope said, "Yes. It was a very disturbing aspect of this. You can look at many of the
people involved in this (names several); all have been affected, from post-traumatic stress to being 'messed with' in some way. One was John Burrows (sp?), who has been attempting to organize a reunion and is lobbying for congressional hearings on it. The personnel involved were threatened by military, some have physical problems such as radiation exposure, and some have psychological consequences. They say that the chain of command let them down. Some have been on Larry King. You can see someone who has been through a bad situation, in their eyes and voices. They are beginning to find their voices. Some are curious; some are angry. All want an explanation of what happened to them and why were they put through the consequences.

Q: Was there something else to this - religious, metaphysical, supernatural, other dimensional? Might it have also challenged their previous worldview? Because that has happened to people after Roswell and other events. They said they would never look at the world the same again.

A: Most definitely they believe they experienced something extra-terrestrial, intra-dimensional, or even inter-temporal (from the future). These perceptions come up all the time, and it has changed their worldviews. They all believe they have encountered something other-worldly. Whether they are right or wrong, it has had a 'transformative' effect on them.

Q: Have there been other issues involving abductions, crop circles, and other related issues connected to cases you investigated?

A: Yes. All these things tend to be connected to each other. You can't run a UFO project without getting drawn in to these other mysteries. I've run into animal mutilations, abductions, crop circles, remote viewing, ghosts, all sorts of things.

Q: Did any stand out?

A: GHOSTS were interesting. We got a lot of ghost reports, even in the Ministry of Defense Headquarters. We had ghost reports from guards, MPs, etc., and there were parts of the building where these people didn't want to go. The same thing was happening at the Department of State Headquarters, and you got used to it going on all the time. Very interesting.

Q: You also wrote two UFO books and two novels, and your website is www,nickpope.net. You were a total disbeliever before becoming involved in the UFO Project?

A: Yes. On my website I have articles, images, etc., and everything is free for the public to use any way they like. I want the information to get out there. Feel free to put articles on your own website, gratis.

Q: This brings me back to the released files. There were not just disclosure groups, but pilots, professional people, military. Even Winston Churchill wrote a memo in 1952. What can you tell us about that part of the released files that relates to scientists, gov't officials, air traffic controllers?

A: In this latest batch released, there were over 6,000 pages of documents, just in the last batch ... pilot reports, air traffic controllers, scientists, politicians, these reports all stand out. One, in Jan 1995, was a Boeing 737 approaching Manchester airport at about 9000 '. Suddenly a craft flashes across the front of the aircraft. The 1st officer is about to take evasive action so violent that it could have brought down the airplane, had he taken it. The only thing that stopped him was that this thing had gone before he could even react. Both he pilot and the first officer submitted an official report to the Ministry of Defense, and the conclusion was that no explanation was ever found for this, and they commended both for coming forward and reporting it. They said that the risk to the aircraft was inaccessible...just genuinely unknown. They didn't know what to make of it.

Another case from 1999 involving a senior air controller. In Scotland, he tracked a UFO, on radar, that was about a mile wide, travelling at over 1,000 mph. He assessed this as a real UFO. No explanation was ever found. There are numerous cases like this, one involving a person driving a car, which was enveloped by a strange cube of light; his radio cut out, his cell phone cut out, and afterward he became quite ill and went to a doctor. He had a skin rash, vomiting. There was strange debris dust found on the car. The AF took this away...we don't know where the sample is now and don't know the conclusion of the investigation. Something is going on.

Q: On the 1997 Boeing 737 a/c, was there any other kind of support, like radar?

A: No. And that was quite disturbing. You would expect something like that to have been tracked on radar. On the other hand, stealth tech has been around for many years. Lack of radar doesn't mean something wasn't there; radar will soon be antiquated anyway.

Q: What are your views about the MOD (Ministry of Defense)? Did your views change from
the time you began working for the MOD until you left the Department?

A: Yes. Of course, it's important for me to say that I served for 21 years in the MOD, so my time on the UFO Project - 3 yrs - was only one of a number of different jobs I did. I've been involved in security jobs, finance jobs, case work jobs, etc. In relation to UFOs, certainly I was pretty skeptical about the whole thing at the beginning. My exposure to the archive of UFO files, and my day-to-day investigation of the newly reported cases made me change my mind from that of a skeptic to, "Well, I don't know what the answer is to all this, but it's NOT just airplane lights and weather balloons."

Q: What's the MOD's policy on UFOs today, Nick? It seems as if they've closed the department down. They've publicly released all these files and are letting the public make up it's own mind. Is it that they've concluded even if there is something going on they can't do anything about it, or what is the position?

A: I think, frankly, they're in a state of confusion on this. On 12/1/2009 they formally terminated the UFO Project. But, really, all that meant is that they stopped taking reports from the public. Because, I know, as somebody who served 21 years there, you can absolutely take it to the bank that if a military pilot reports something, if a radar operator tracks an unidentified target on the screen, that will be looked at. It's just that it will happen outside of a formally constituted UFO project. So, MOD publicly is out of the game, but privately of course they'll still look at the really interesting stuff.

Q: In your opinion has something new, maybe beyond even government purview, taken its place? [We know that there is a joint military/entity group which is classified far above presidents or any other classified project...refer to Chuck Missler interview, also. It would be highly unlikely that Nick Pope would have any idea about these super-classified programs.]

A: No, I don't think so. I think somebody's going to be looking at this, but on an ad hoc basis. Actually, your question poses a very interesting thought - that one way (and I'm not saying this is happening, but, intellectually, I know that it can be done ) -one way to take something outside the sight of congressional scrutiny, outside of FOIA, is to put it in the private sector. And certainly with some of the most highly classified studies that MOD has ever done on UFOs, on things like remote viewing, they'd be done through defense contractors. So, maybe that's where people should be looking. [That's the first place I'd look. Of course, I'd find nothing.]

Q: In your heart of hearts, what do you believe? Are there intelligent life forms, ETs, outside of earth's reality?

A: Life out there - almost definitely. Are we being visited? I don't know. I can't rule it out.

Q: We know that the Vatican astronomers are studying deep space. Monsignor Balducci said some years ago that not only were we being visited, but the highest levels of the Vatican were even aware of it, and even in contact with these things.

A: I met Balducci on several occasions. He seems a truly honorable and spiritual man, and yeah...maybe he was right. It's just that I have no way of ... obviously... accessing the world that he moves in [lots of stuttering and stammering here, for the first time in the interview; his entire demeanor changed...why? He doesn't want to say what he really thinks about this].

Q: Now if it's possible that we in fact are in contact with some intelligence, as he insinuated, is official disclosure soon? Any gut feeling?

A: I don't know. It may not be our decision, of course. All of this essentially is going to be 'event-led' and it may not be our call.

Q: Well, it definitely won't be our call if some mother ship appears over the British MOD tomorrow night; it's going to be out of our hands. You've written extensively about your work with the MOD. Is talking about this not a problem, since you signed the Official Secrets Act?

A: I signed the OSA, but what that basically means is that I can...my position (hem/haw) basically is like when you catch a retired general talking about how the war's going in Afghanistan ...they can talk about their experiences, their opinions, but they can't talk about tactics and such. [ Changed demeanor again, even more than last time. He is not telling what he knows or suspects..]

End of Interview with Nick Pope.

Royal Heir

UFOs: Disclosure of the Truth?

In January of this year The Royal Society, the national academy of science of the United Kingdom invited people from NASA, the European Space Agency and the UN Office for Outer Space Affairs to participate in discussion entitled, "The Detection Of Extraterrestrial Life and the Consequences for Science and Society." The President of the Royal Society, Lord Martin Rees, announced that aliens may be "staring us in the face" in a form humans are unable to recognize.

A number of other speakers said that we now have overwhelming evidence - proof - of alien life. Simon Conway Morris, professor of evolutionary paleobiology at Cambridge University, expressed concern about these ETs, saying that they "might not only resemble us, but may have our foibles such as greed, violence and a tendency to exploit others' resources. Other speakers also said that their intentions might be deceptive. Ya think?

Vatican astronomer, Guy Consolmagno said that we are facing a discovery of extraterrestrial intelligence soon. One Monsignor Corrado Balducci said a while back that aliens are already interacting with earth and that Vatican's leaders are aware of it. At the forum there was much discussion among Christians, Jews and Muslims which focused on the potential impact such an event might have on their religious beliefs and on the beliefs of their worshippers.

Some had concerns that it could throw the human race into a spiritual identity crisis that could leave some questioning their faith in God. However, I don't think this is likely for the majority of Christians, certainly, because most of those who call themselves Christians have no clue what Christian doctrine teaches. They can - and often do - easily incorporate other religions into their beliefs with no problem at all - and come up with a sort of amalgamated 'custom' religion.

Of course, once again, those who were fundamentalist evangelicals stood alone in their views. Most Catholics, Jews and Muslims would have no trouble 'altering' their views on faith should unexpected and bizarre information emerge from ETs which might conflict with the orthodox views of their faiths. The conservative evangelicals were of the opinion that these entities are demonic in nature and expect that they play a role in a future great deception that gives rise to the appearance of Antichrist. "I have become thoroughly convinced that UFOs are real," popular Christian writer Hal Lindsey wrote. "I believe these beings are not only extraterrestrial but supernatural in origin. To be blunt, I think they are demons."

Professor of psychology Elizabeth L. Hillstrom in her book, Testing the Spirits, says that a growing number of scholars support the conclusion that UFOnauts are synonymous with historical demons.

Perhaps the most widely respected UFO researcher, Jacques Vallee, has written a number of books over a period of years on the subject, and they are generally considered to be classics in the field. Vallee (who is not a Christian, as I recall) cautiously sketches out his belief that some agency with enormous power of various kinds is and has been "staging" thousands of technologically complex, essentially 'fake' UFO sightings around the world with the pointed intention of manipulating and guiding civilization, and man himself, in a very specific direction.

Vallee says the apparent goal of this agency is to encourage mankind, via a belief in the impending arrival from the heavens of the benevolent 'space brothers,' to become anti-scientific, irrational, infantile, dependent, and endlessly hopeful that the essential problems of man---including his mortality---can be permanently overcome through the multi-prismed salvation the [false] "space brothers" offer. Other goals include 'the reversal of the scale of values,' "leading to a new understanding of social good, the abolition of borders, and the death of nationalism," 'goals' which are certainly becoming the reality in today's American. Which raises the question: who or what has such enormous, organizational God-like power?

All of the major researchers including Pierre Guerin, a UFO researcher and a scientist associated with the French National Council for Scientific Research; and veteran researcher John Keel; and many others seem to all agree that the UFO manifestations seem to be, by and large, merely minor variations of the age-old demonological phenomenon.

Having studied this phenomena for over 35 years I agree that these are hyper-dimensional manifestations rather than inter-galactic or extra-terrestrial. In other words, they are spiritual entities who inhabit dimensions right next to us, but to which we of the flesh are blind and 'see through a glass darkly.' These entities have the ability to manifest in our three-dimensional world when they so choose.

I just ran across a 20-hour seminar called "Official Disclosure: Prepare For Contact." It includes top researchers, including ex-government agents with above top-secret security clearance, world-famous field investigators, physicists and theologians, most of whose work I am familiar with. I am listening to this seminar and decided it would be the easiest way to write about UFOs on my blog, since the seminar material is already organized and will save me a lot of work. Not-to-mention that it is the latest, hot off the press material.

Stay tuned for my reportage of this seminar.

Royal Heir